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GSBN: Digest for 10/4/02



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-> Re: GSBN:test results
     by DCAT info@...
-> Re: Royal Nominations
     by billc_lists@...
-> Re:  GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations
     by Strawnet@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations
     by MattsMyhrman@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations
     by MattsMyhrman@...


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Date: 4 Oct 2002 10:57:13 -0500
From: DCAT info@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:test results

Probably an easily dismissed question re: waterproofing earthen 
plasters, but I've often wondered whether the siloxane-based sealers 
that have been promoted for cement stucco would be applicable. 
Obviously they stray from the purist ethic, though I wonder if anyone 
has tested these sealers, noted for their gore-tex-like effect of 
keeping liquid moisture out without overly diminishing vapor 
permeability?

I would also like the test results forwarded to my personal e-mail 
account if possible (anovelli@aol.com), as I can't seem to find them 
on our main subscription here.

Many thanks!

Tony Novelli
DCAT-Tucson



>Howdy, baleheads -
>
>There has been a moderate amount of clucking in the international strawbale
>henhouse over the recently published (and perplexing) test results.
>
>Lonesome Rob Tom was first to sound off, sharing his usual rants via
>satellite hookup while herding mooses across the frozen Canadian tundra . .
>thengya, Rob, thengyaverramuch
>
>Bill Steen chimed in from up in the Patagonian mountains above Tucson,
>stomping around the desert with a five pound sledge, whacking every lump in
>sight, muttering under his breath like Gabby Hayes about gol durn ceeement
>plasters, Athena and the children huddled terrified inside the deadbolted
>house . . .
>
>And John Glassford, our John the Baptist of earthen plasters, honey and
>locusts dripping from his chin, a wild glint in his eye, came the most
>directly and clearly to the point by writing:
>
>" . . . Which begs the question, if cement/lime mixes rely on certain
>temperature and moisture levels to cure and earth/straw does not, and
>earthen renders are proving not quite as strong, but well above California
>code limitations, why not use earth as a preference?  By this I mean look at
>ways of getting earthen/sand etc. render premixes onto the main stream straw
>bale building best practice list . . . Makes so much sense and once we have
>the water proofing angle sorted out and how best to keep moisture out then
>we are miles in front from all angles.  Especially as we know are able to
>pump our earthen mixes on without any problems from first to last coat."
>
>
>I completely agree, and we will be doing a lot more testing of earthen
>renders for structural and moisture properties.  I would also add that we
>need to identify, for durability, not only how to make earthen plasters shed
>water, but how to keep them from flaking and dusting too much.
>
>(I can hear you all scoffing   "Limewash!  Duh!" , and I doubt we'll come up
>with anything better or different, but you never know.)
>
>keep those cards and letters comin', folks.  We're listening.
>
>Bruce King, PE
>Director, Ecological Building Network
>209 Caledonia St.
>Sausalito, CA 94965
>(415) 331-7630
>fax 332-4072
>www.ecobuildnetwork.org
>ecobruce@...
>
>----
>For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN 
>list, send email to GSBN@...HELP in the 
>SUBJECT line.
>----

- -- 
************

Development Center for Appropriate Technology
P.O. Box 27513, Tucson, AZ  85713
(520) 624-6628 voice / (520) 798-3701 fax
http://www.dcat.net

The Development Center for Appropriate Technology is a not for profit
organization that is supported solely by foundation grants and charitable
contributions from corporations, small business, and individuals. Our mission
is to enhance the health of the planet and our communities by promoting a
shift to sustainable construction and development through leadership,
strategic relationships, and education. To learn about how you can support
DCAT's crucial work, visit our website at http://www.dcat.net.


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Date: 4 Oct 2002 10:59:51 -0500
From: billc_lists@...
Subject: Re: Royal Nominations

Bruce King wrote:

>Final note:  I nominate Tim Owen-Kennedy and John Swearingen to this list
>(though maybe John is already lurking on the list, I don't remember).  They
>are two of the premier bale builders in California, have contributed
>enormously to our knowledge and fun, and, well, just ought to be on this
>list.
>
>Do I hear an "Aye"?

John has been invited but never responded one way or the other.  I 
suspect he may be of the "too busy for another email list" variety.

I don't know Tim (or his email address), but if y'all think he's a 
good fit, i'll send out the invitation.
- -- 
Bill Christensen
billc@...

Green Building Professionals Directory: http://directory.sustainablesources.com
Sustainable Building Calendar: http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/
Green Real Estate: http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/
Straw Bale Registry: http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/


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Date: 4 Oct 2002 13:16:24 -0500
From: Strawnet@...
Subject: Re:  GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations

>Bruce King wrote:
>
>>Final note:  I nominate Tim Owen-Kennedy and John Swearingen to this list
>>(though maybe John is already lurking on the list, I don't remember).  They
>>are two of the premier bale builders in California, have contributed
>>enormously to our knowledge and fun, and, well, just ought to be on this
>>list.
>>
>>Do I hear an "Aye"?

Aye...

David

David Eisenberg, Director
Development Center for Appropriate Technology
P.O. Box 27513, Tucson, AZ  85713
(520) 624-6628 voice / (520) 798-3701 fax
strawnet@...
http://www.dcat.net

The Development Center for Appropriate Technology is a 501(c)(3) 
non-profit organization. Our primary support comes from foundation grants 
and charitable contributions from individuals and businesses, and from 
our educational and training programs and consulting services. Our 
mission is to enhance the health of the planet and our communities by 
promoting a shift to sustainable construction and development practices 
through leadership, strategic relationships, and education. To learn 
about DCAT's work and how you can support it, please visit our website at 
www.dcat.net



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Date: 4 Oct 2002 16:42:46 -0500
From: MattsMyhrman@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations

Aye on Bruce's nominations.

The next time some money is generated for testing, I'


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Date: 4 Oct 2002 17:57:37 -0500
From: MattsMyhrman@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Royal Nominations

Sorry about that premature epistle-ation.  Judy's laptop has a hair trigger.

So, again, aye on Bruce's nominations.

And, again, the next time some money gets generated, I'd propose that testing 
be done to measure the resistance to both in-plane and out-of-plane lateral 
forces of walls corsetted (some might say "exteriorly pinned", although if 
you don't stick the "pins" into the walls, have they been pinned?) with both 
one-half inch diameter rebar and with bamboo.  For comparative purposes, one 
would want to do the same tests on walls pinned in the traditional way with 
both materials.  I would assume that it would be acceptable to do the testing 
on wall panels that were loaded compressively to simulate a light roof load.  
It would also be nice, as a control, to test panels that had neither interior 
pins nor corsetting.  I know that some Canadian testing indicated that loaded 
walls with no pinning or corsetting were as resistant to out-of-plane forces 
as loaded walls with interior rebar pins, but I believe that no in-plane 
testing was done, leaving a big hole in the argument that unpinned walls are 
"as strong" as pinned ones, once they have a roof sitting on them.  Even if 
loaded walls did turn out to be as resistant to both types of forces, the 
question of pinning or corsetting would still remain an issue for walls, in 
either a load-bearing or a post-and-beam building, that were not carrying 
roof load.

Prescriptive codes for any developing system will inevitably become outdated, 
but are the only way to avoid the cost of engineering analysis being required 
for each building. So if we want to be able to update the code for 
load-bearing straw-bale, in particular, we're going to have to find ways to 
do the testing that will convince the code administrators that new methods 
can be safely substituted for old ones, or that certain requirements can even 
be dropped altogether.

How about an international "yard sale" hosted on e-Bay?

Greetings to all.  We're still hoping that Judy's health problems won't keep 
us form seeing some of you in Australia in December.


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