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GSBN: Digest for 10/15/02



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-> STC for bale walls
     by MattsMyhrman@...
-> Re: STC of Straw bales
     by "Rob Tom" rw_tom@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales
     by Rene Dalmeijer rened@...
-> Re: GSBN:French SB book in the making
     by Huff 'n' Puff Constructions huffnpuff@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales
     by Huff 'n' Puff Constructions huffnpuff@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales
     by Catherine Wanek blackrange@...


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Date: 15 Oct 2002 12:36:51 -0500
From: MattsMyhrman@...
Subject: STC for bale walls


Dear Katie and GSBNers,

Last year I helped Lars Keller clean up an English-language version of a 
summary of some testing to determine the "airsound insulation" of straw-bale 
walls.  They concluded that the walls tested had an airsound insulation 
value,"R'' w" (the w is actually a subscript), of about 54 dB.  Lars should 
be able to tell us all how to access this summary.

Hope this helps.

Matts Myhrman / Judy Knox                        mattsmyhrman@...     
Out On  Bale, (un) Ltd.                                  
2509 N. Campbell Ave., #292                       judyknox42@...
Tucson, AZ  85719                                       
Office message phone  (520) 622-6896




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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>Dear Katie and GSBNers,
 
 Last year I helped Lars Keller clean up an English-language version of a
summary of some testing to determine the "airsound insulation" of straw-bale
walls.  They concluded that the walls tested had an airsound insulation
value,"R'' w" (the w is actually a subscript), of about 54 dB.  Lars
should be able to tell us all how to access this summary.
 
 Hope this helps.
 
 Matts Myhrman / Judy Knox
                       mattsmyhrman@...
    
 Out On  Bale, (un) Ltd.
                                 
 2509 N. Campbell Ave., #292
                      judyknox42@...
 Tucson, AZ  85719
                                      
 Office message phone  (520) 622-6896
 </FONT></HTML>

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Date: 15 Oct 2002 14:51:59 -0500
From: "Rob Tom" rw_tom@...
Subject: Re: STC of Straw bales

>on 10/10/02 8:49 PM,  billc_lists@...:
>
> > I recall there was some discussion of SB sound transmission on the
> > list some time ago, including anecdotal evidence provided by the
> > Straw Wolf's rock band or some such.  Anyone have any solid numbers
> > for Katie?  Failing that, anyone have any good stories to tell? ;-)

to which Bruce, King of Sausalito responded with an enginoidal
[paraphrased] " Nope. Sorry eh ?"

I don't have any "solid" numbers for Katie either but I don't think that it 
would be unreasonable for Katie suggest to her computationally-inclined 
enquirer that the STC rating would be in excess of STC 61;  the rating for 
which a 6" CMU wall with batt-insulated/drywall-faced, 3.5" steel studs on 
*one* face, is listed as being, for the purposes of the Ontario Building 
Code.

Katie's suggestion wouldn't be unreasonable given that the faces of the CMU 
consist of approx. the same thickness & material that comprise the skins of 
a plastered SB wall, and 18 to 24 inches of straw should provide at least 
the same acoustic isolation as 3.5" of fiberglass insulation.

If a plastered SB wall were subjected to testing, I  wouldn't be at all 
surprised if the actual STC rating were in excess of STC 70.


  --- * ---
Robert W. Tom
Kanata, Ontario, Canada
rw_tom@...

please visit:  http://www.theHungerSite.com daily




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Date: 15 Oct 2002 16:23:33 -0500
From: Rene Dalmeijer rened@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales

Bruce, Tom

There is a chance that we will be doing a test here regarding the SB 
acoustic insulation value. The test if executed will be in a test facillity 
at the Eindhoven University normally used to test window frames so I expect 
that the measured values will till how well the test facilty functions. I 
am sure that a properly executed SB wall has excellent sound insulation 
properties far exceeding normal brick walls. What are STC numbers? We don't 
use this qualification here. BTW the test will incorporate a spectral 
distribution.

At 12:22 AM 10/15/02, you wrote:
> > I recall there was some discussion of SB sound transmission on the
> > list some time ago, including anecdotal evidence provided by the
> > Straw Wolf's rock band or some such.  Anyone have any solid numbers
> > for Katie?  Failing that, anyone have any good stories to tell? ;-)
>
>
>To my knowledge, no formal tests have been done to provide STC numbers at
>various sound frequency levels (such as building engineers sometimes need).
>We all know they're mighty quiet, and that it's hard to shout through a wall
>to someone on the other side, but don't have the exact geek numbers as yet.
>
>Or, if someone does, I would very much appreciate learning of it, as the
>culmination of the EBNet test program aims to be a compilation of ALL
>testing of ALL sorts done to date - by EBNet or by others.

Greetings,

Rene Dalmeijer



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Date: 15 Oct 2002 17:02:21 -0500
From: Huff 'n' Puff Constructions huffnpuff@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:French SB book in the making

Dear Andre

What is your deadline with the book and slides?  I am very busy with the
conference and trying to earn a quid to keep going, like everyone else.
Let me know how much time I have for your book etc but I feel that I cannot do
anything until early January 2003.

Salaams John.



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Date: 15 Oct 2002 17:02:48 -0500
From: Huff 'n' Puff Constructions huffnpuff@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales

G 'day One and All

In some pain RSI of the elbow too much rendering and typing.  Need a
secretary!

Anyway for what it is worth here is a copy of our testing on sound for a two
string straw bale wall that we built some moons ago in Sydney.

The Straw Wolf

G' Day One and All

We have just completed testing (at least three years ago now!)
the sound qualities of "The Practice
Pad".  The Practice Pad consists of three sound recording studios in
Surry Hills, an inner Sydney Office and Residential area, that we built
two years ago for Bruce Thomas.  The Studio is located on the third
floor of a 6-storey office block.  There are five straw bale walls 450
mm thick (18") which were sheeted in Gyprock 10mm on a 4x2 timber stud
wall.  Each room has a double cavity door 450 mm deep no windows and a
wall mounted air conditioner.

The University of Technology Sydney kindly lent me the equipment to
measure the sound levels.  We need these results for the College of
Sustainable Building (Straw Panel Factory) that we will build in 99 (03 now )
in
Ganmain in the middle of the village.  The walls of the College will be
900mm (3') thick, the machinery in the factory (college) will consist of
a very large band saw run by an electric motor solar powered.

The tests on The Practice Pad were carried out by myself with a couple
of witnesses, no cheating was allowed.  The instrument was a Radio Shack
Sound Level Monitor made in China under a Canadian licence, does that
make it Canadian?  I used two weighting's in the tests in the studio and
these were:

Weighting A curve frequency of 500-10,000 Hz range
      "   C   "       "      " 200-18,000  "   "   I think need to
confirm the C however the C frequency is for musical instruments and the
A for humans I think.

Anyway the results are as follows:   The three studios were in full
operation and three very loud bands were using the studios at the time
of the recordings:

Inside Studio 2 Background Noise Level                  A 55 db

(No Bands Playing)                                      Air Con 61 db

                                                        C 54 db

                                                        Air Con 61 db

Outside Studio 2 Background Noise Level                 A 58-62 db

(No Bands Playing)                                      C 63-68 db

Inside Studio 2, One Very Loud Band Playing             C 114-117 db

Outside Studio 2, Three Very Loud Bands Playing         A 62 db

        (Meter 12" from walls)                          C 71 db

Outside Studio 2 Three Very Loud Bands Playing          A 60-62 db

        (Meter 10' from walls)                          C 67-68 db

Outside Studio 3 All Bands Playing                      A 65-66 db

        (Meter under the air con)                       C 75-78 db

There was sound travel coming from the air con from Studio 3 from all
the other studios.  (This a problem Bruce has to rectify.)
Outside the window Street Noise Levels                  A 68-71 db

                                                        C 68-70 db

Therefore it can be said that the straw bale walls are very effective in
reducing sound as if you all did not know that anyway.  I just have not
been able to get any figures anywhere so here they are for what they are
worth.  It was a very scientific testing conducted with meter in hand
and an ale in the other. (Only joking).

I also tested some other well-known noise producers whilst I was in
Sydney.  I used the A frequency.

Inside a house that I was staying in at Sydeneham Background 51 db

                                        Jumbo Overhead       82 db

                                        Jumbo Outside       104 db

It was interesting to see how some Sydneysiders have to live!

On the M5 Freeway  104-109 db

On Parramatta Road   83-102 db

Salaams Straw Wolf
http://strawbale.archinet.com.au





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Date: 15 Oct 2002 20:31:33 -0500
From: Catherine Wanek blackrange@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: STC of Straw bales


I recall that there was some sound transference testing done in Australia, 
too, a few years back.  John Glassford would know the parties/testing 
involved.....  John?

Also, for what it's worth, there's a big tarped (unplastered) straw or 
hay-bale sound wall built at the Albany, NY airport, which we ran a blurb 
about in TLS # 34, pg 27.  We were sent a tiny article about it, from "The 
Flyer," Vol. 2, #2.  The article is quoted as saying "The U-shaped 
roof-less structure is used to absorb and divert noise during testing and 
maintenance of aircraft engines.  It has reduced aircraft noise by 20 
deciBels, as measured in adjacent residential areas.  The pen is based on 
similar facilities in Fresno & San Luis Obispo."

Maybe there's information from these closer-to-home CA facilities, that 
Bruce "fly me" King could check into.....?

Catherine

At 11:01 PM 10/15/02 +0200, you wrote:
>Bruce, Tom
>
>There is a chance that we will be doing a test here regarding the SB 
>acoustic insulation value. The test if executed will be in a test 
>facillity at the Eindhoven University normally used to test window frames 
>so I expect that the measured values will till how well the test facilty 
>functions. I am sure that a properly executed SB wall has excellent sound 
>insulation properties far exceeding normal brick walls. What are STC 
>numbers? We don't use this qualification here. BTW the test will 
>incorporate a spectral distribution.
>
>At 12:22 AM 10/15/02, you wrote:
>> > I recall there was some discussion of SB sound transmission on the
>> > list some time ago, including anecdotal evidence provided by the
>> > Straw Wolf's rock band or some such.  Anyone have any solid numbers
>> > for Katie?  Failing that, anyone have any good stories to tell? ;-)
>>
>>
>>To my knowledge, no formal tests have been done to provide STC numbers at
>>various sound frequency levels (such as building engineers sometimes need).
>>We all know they're mighty quiet, and that it's hard to shout through a wall
>>to someone on the other side, but don't have the exact geek numbers as yet.
>>
>>Or, if someone does, I would very much appreciate learning of it, as the
>>culmination of the EBNet test program aims to be a compilation of ALL
>>testing of ALL sorts done to date - by EBNet or by others.
>
>Greetings,
>
>Rene Dalmeijer
>

>



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<html>
<font size=3>I recall that there was some sound transference testing done
in Australia, too, a few years back.  John Glassford would know the
parties/testing involved.....  John? 
 
Also, for what it's worth, there's a big tarped (unplastered) straw or
hay-bale sound wall built at the Albany, NY airport, which we ran a blurb
about in TLS # 34, pg 27.  We were sent a tiny article about it,
from "The Flyer," Vol. 2, #2.  The article is quoted as
saying "The U-shaped roof-less structure is used to absorb and
divert noise during testing and maintenance of aircraft engines.  It
has reduced aircraft noise by 20 deciBels, as measured in adjacent
residential areas.  The pen is based on similar facilities in Fresno
&amp; San Luis Obispo." 
 
Maybe there's information from these closer-to-home CA facilities, that
Bruce "fly me" King could check into.....? 
 
Catherine 
 
At 11:01 PM 10/15/02 +0200, you wrote: 
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite>Bruce, Tom 
 
There is a chance that we will be doing a test here regarding the SB
acoustic insulation value. The test if executed will be in a test
facillity at the Eindhoven University normally used to test window frames
so I expect that the measured values will till how well the test facilty
functions. I am sure that a properly executed SB wall has excellent sound
insulation properties far exceeding normal brick walls. What are STC
numbers? We don't use this qualification here. BTW the test will
incorporate a spectral distribution. 
 
At 12:22 AM 10/15/02, you wrote: 
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite>> I recall there was some
discussion of SB sound transmission on the 
> list some time ago, including anecdotal evidence provided by
the 
> Straw Wolf's rock band or some such.  Anyone have any solid
numbers 
> for Katie?  Failing that, anyone have any good stories to tell?
;-) 
 
 
To my knowledge, no formal tests have been done to provide STC numbers
at 
various sound frequency levels (such as building engineers sometimes
need). 
We all know they're mighty quiet, and that it's hard to shout through a
wall 
to someone on the other side, but don't have the exact geek numbers as
yet. 
 
Or, if someone does, I would very much appreciate learning of it, as
the 
culmination of the EBNet test program aims to be a compilation of
ALL 
testing of ALL sorts done to date - by EBNet or by
others.</blockquote> 
Greetings, 
 
Rene Dalmeijer 
 
- ---- 
For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN list,
send email to GSBN@...HELP in the SUBJECT
line.   
- ---- 
 
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