[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

GSBN: Digest for 10/2/03



This message contains a digest of the messages posted to the list today. If
you reply to this message, please be sure to change the subject line to
something meaningful. Also, be careful not to include the entire text of this
message in your reply.



---------------------------------------------------------------------


-> Herbert & Astrid of Austria?
     by billc_lists@...
-> Re: Mechanical Systems in Commercial SB building 
     by "Rob Tom" rw_tom@...
-> RE: GSBN:Mechanical Systems in Commercial SB building
     by bainbridge bainbrid@...


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 2 Oct 2003 02:29:00 -0500
From: billc_lists@...
Subject: Herbert & Astrid of Austria?

Hi folks,

Apparently Herbert & Astrid Gruber of Austria, formerly on this list, 
have discontinued their email address (asbn@aon.at).

Anyone have a new one for them?

- -- 
Bill Christensen
http://sustainablesources.com/contact/

Green Building Professionals Directory: http://directory.sustainablesources.com
Sustainable Building Calendar: http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/
Green Real Estate: http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/
Straw Bale Registry: http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/
Books/videos/software: http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 2 Oct 2003 12:20:17 -0500
From: "Rob Tom" rw_tom@...
Subject: Re: Mechanical Systems in Commercial SB building 

Jeff;

The added insulation afforded by the SB walls will account for only the very 
smallest portion of the potential overall energy savings in a well-designed, 
energy-efficeint building. (ie typically in retail buildings, even here in 
MooseLand, the largest load comes from lighting ,hence the importance of a 
good daylighting strategy in reducing overall energy consumption) with the 
greatest potential energy savings being provided by intelligently-designed 
mechanical and electrical systems as is illustrated by the numbers below, 
based on a case study here in Ottawa of a retail building with a small SB 
component.

( cut and pasted from

http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/newbuildings/buildings/casestudies-etudesdecas/mec_performance.cfm?PrintView=N&Text=N%20

    )

=================
Energy Savings ($)

Exterior sunshades
20,000

Extra wall insulation
14,000

Extra roof insulation
40,000

Upgrades to glazing units
36,000

Energy management system
37,000

Upgrades to mechanical equipment
50,000

Upgrades to electrical equipment
81,000

Total
$ 278,000
===============

So, based on the above example, if the "cadillac system" is one which is 
intelligently designed (and seemingly complicated to us non-mechenginoidal 
sorts) , as opposed to merely being oversized, the energy savings (and 
resultant short payback period) may in fact, justify the initial incremental 
cost.

OTOH, if the system is merely oversized "just to be on the safe side" (as 
happens too often in lazy mech eng "design") and has all the latest bells 
and knerpwhistles just to be kewl , it could of course, result in an energy 
penalty, not to mention being a needless waste of resources (both physical 
and monetary) and a PITA to live with.  Similarly, a "simple" (read: 
"cheap") design which fails to perform to rigorous EE/health standards can 
also have the same problems and may not be inexpensive at all, in the long 
run.


Surely, the mechanical engineer should be able to provide some numbers for 
savings  based on projected performance to explain the rationale for and 
justify her more costly/complicated design ?


  --- * ---
Robert W. Tom
Kanata, Ontario, Canada
rw_tom@...

please visit:  http://www.theHungerSite.com daily


jeff@...:

>I have a client who is trying to get his mechanical engineers to understand
>the level of energy efficiency of a bale building, while also attempting to
>help them see the world outside of their small boxes.  He wants to simplify
>his mechanical systems, and they have designed him a cadillac system.  The
>project is a natural food store in Montana and we are looking for examples
>of not-too-complicated systems placed in commercial bale structures.  Can
>anyone help with this one?  Any example projects come to  mind?

_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus



----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 2 Oct 2003 14:00:26 -0500
From: bainbridge bainbrid@...
Subject: RE: GSBN:Mechanical Systems in Commercial SB building

Another candidate company - would be Davis Energy Group - clever is 
as clever does.... They are very good. A food store would have some 
neat synergies of refrigeration waste heat...for....
Daylighting of course...
http://www.davisenergy.com/main2.htm

Marshall Hunt might be a good adviser as well - not sure where his 
hat is hanging these days.

Cheers

David


I have a client who is trying to get his mechanical engineers to understand
the level of energy efficiency of a bale building, while also attempting to
help them see the world outside of their small boxes.  He wants to simplify
his mechanical systems, and they have designed him a cadillac system.  The
project is a natural food store in Montana and we are looking for examples
of not-too-complicated systems placed in commercial bale structures.  Can
anyone help with this one?  Any example projects come to  mind?

Jeff Ruppert, P.E.
Odisea, LLC
Consulting, Engineering and Design
1022 Main St.
Carbondale, CO  81623
303.881.2905
jeff@...
www.odiseanet.com
- -- 
David A. Bainbridge
Associate Professor, Sustainable Management
Room B-1
United States International College of Business
Alliant International University
10455 Pomerado Road
San Diego, CA 92131

Fax (858) 635-4730	Ph (858) 635-4616

It is better to be crudely right than precisely wrong. Todd Neubauer
http://www.ases.org/about_ases/awards/passive_pioneer.htm
http://www.sustainableenergy.org/resources/technologies/solar_passive.htm
http://www.serg.sdsu.edu/SERG/techniques.html
ISIE	http://www.yale.edu/is4ie/
USSEE 	http://www.ussee.org/about/
http://www.sddt.com/reports/2003/02/goinggreen/te.cfm


----------------------------------------------------------------------

End of Digest

To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in
the subject.