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GSBN: Digest for 12/20/07



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---------------------------------------------------------------------


-> Re: GSBN:Inquiry from France
     by noe@...
-> Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by "Bob Bolles" bobbolles01@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by billc billc_lists@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by Tom Hahn tomhahn@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by jfstraube@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by Joyce Coppinger jc10508@...
-> RE: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by stoneandstraw@...
-> RE: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members
     by stoneandstraw@...
-> Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
     by "Bob Bolles" bobbolles01@...
-> RE: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members
     by billc billc_lists@...


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 06:18:56 -0500
From: noe@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Inquiry from France

For answer to an old mail from the 08/12
> Hello all,
>
> We are building to, in France, with jumbo bales.
> We have build a house and an industrial building for the french 
> company who make ready clay mix for the plastering (Akterre)
> The building was 750 m2.
>
> So we are very involve in this kind of technique, making technical 
> drawing to.
> We are starting an european meeting, only about jumbo bales techniques.
>
> You should inter in contact with Max Vittrup Jensen 
> max@...,  who is making a thesis about this technique.
> I'm not so far of you, I'm in the south of Lyon, nice to meet you 
> Olivier !
>
> All good and full of all
>
> Noe ...
>
>
>
> David Eisenberg a ecrit :
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I am forwarding the message below we received at DCAT. I imagine there
>> are numerous people here, including in France, who may be able to offer
>> assistance. Thanks in advance for your help.
>>
>> Please respond to o.turlier@...and it would be good if
>> those of you who do respond could also copy the GSBN listerve so the
>> rest of us know that you have done so and also have the benefit of the
>> information you share.
>>
>> Warmest regards,
>>
>> David Eisenberg
>>
>> -------------------------------------
>> Email: o.turlier@...
>> Questions: Hi everybody,
>> I'm interested in big straw bale (900 mm x 1200 mm x 2000 mm, approx.)
>> construction, because i see those ones usable for a load-bearing wall
>> (without any reinforcement frame).
>> Do you have run tests on compression loads, etc. I'd like to see a
>> Hooke curb  or a Young modulus if available.
>> TIA for any answer.
>> Olivier TURLIER, Marseille, France
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>> More new features than ever.  Check out the new AOL Mail ! -
>>
<a  target="_blank" href="http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003";>http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003</a>

>>
>> ----
>> For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN 
>> list, send email to GSBN@...HELP in the 
>> SUBJECT line.  ----
>>
>>
>
>
>
>





----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 12:04:05 -0500
From: "Bob Bolles" bobbolles01@...
Subject: Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

On Dec 20, 2007 4:25 AM, Bob Bolles bobbolles01@... wrote:

> Deputy Chief, Don Fisher, Fort Mojave Mesa Fire District (Arizona) has
> requested information on two aspects of Straw Bale Buildings 1) Features of
> SB Construction that make our building more fire resistant 2) How to best
> fight a fire in a SB Structure.
>
> Having recently fought his first SB structure fire has motivated him to
> research SB buildings and use that information to write an article in a
> firefighter's magazine.
>
> In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
> plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
> Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
> between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
> attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.
>
> We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
> Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
> dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building
>
> If there is enough response, I will also put together a summary to submit
> to The Last Straw.
>
> Best Regards and Happy Holidays~
>
> bb
>
> Sustainable Building Systems
>
> San Diego CA USA
>


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multipart/alternative
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Date: 20 Dec 2007 12:24:33 -0500
From: billc billc_lists@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

At 9:48 AM -0800 12/20/07, Bob Bolles wrote:
>
>  > In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
>>  plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
>>  Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
>>  between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
>>  attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.

Obviously, this is pretty far from what we consider "best practice".

>  >
>>  We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
>>  Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
>  > dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building

Considering the number of fires we've seen that have taken down
entire houses, I suggest that some clay fire breaks within the walls
at various locations would be wise.  The "french dipped" method of
coating every bale in clay slip before installation would probably be
most effective, but is also time consuming, heavy, and messy (but
messy in a good way).  Alternatively, a layer of clay mortar could be
incorporated at various locations vertically and/or horizontally,
stopping or at least slowing the spread of fire within a bale wall.


- --
Bill Christensen
<<a  target="_blank" href="http://sustainablesources.com/contact/";>http://sustainablesources.com/contact/</a>>

Green Building Professionals Directory: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://directory.sustainablesources.com";>http://directory.sustainablesources.com</a>>
Sustainable Building Calendar: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/";>http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/</a>>
Green Real Estate: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/";>http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/</a>>
Straw Bale Registry: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/";>http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/</a>>
Books/videos/software: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/";>http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/</a>>


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 12:49:31 -0500
From: Tom Hahn tomhahn@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

Bob, Bill and all - Waaaay back in the day, in probably one of the
first couple of The Last Straws I was Editor for (maybe Issue #13,
#14, or #15?... Joyce?), we did an article specifically on a
straw-bale fire.  A good friend of mine, who some of you may know,
Richard Hofmeister, and I did a little forensic investigation and
writeup of the fire that destroyed his famous student straw-bale
shelter at Taliesin West.  He went into a good amount of detail about
what likely started the fire, how it burned, and what fire-fighting
techniques were successful and not...

Tom

>On Dec 20, 2007 4:25 AM, Bob Bolles bobbolles01@... wrote:
>
>>  Deputy Chief, Don Fisher, Fort Mojave Mesa Fire District (Arizona) has
>>  requested information on two aspects of Straw Bale Buildings 1) Features
of
>>  SB Construction that make our building more fire resistant 2) How to best
>>  fight a fire in a SB Structure.
>>
>>  Having recently fought his first SB structure fire has motivated him to
>>  research SB buildings and use that information to write an article in a
>>  firefighter's magazine.
>>
>>  In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
>>  plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
>>  Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
>>  between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
>>  attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.
>>
>>  We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
>>  Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
>>  dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building
>>
>>  If there is enough response, I will also put together a summary to submit
>>  to The Last Straw.
>>
>>  Best Regards and Happy Holidays~
>>
>>  bb
>>
>>  Sustainable Building Systems
>>
>>  San Diego CA USA
>>
>
>
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>list, send email to GSBN@...HELP in the
>SUBJECT line.
>----



----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 13:13:29 -0500
From: jfstraube@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

Love to hear more on how the fire spread
Sounds very dangerous to provide a chimney formed by studs right next to
uncoated SB! This is a nightmare scenario to me. Maybe it was not that bad but
it violates all I thought we knew about proper SB design.


Bob Bolles wrote:
> On Dec 20, 2007 4:25 AM, Bob Bolles bobbolles01@... wrote:
>
>> Deputy Chief, Don Fisher, Fort Mojave Mesa Fire District (Arizona) has
>> requested information on two aspects of Straw Bale Buildings 1) Features of
>> SB Construction that make our building more fire resistant 2) How to best
>> fight a fire in a SB Structure.
>>
>> Having recently fought his first SB structure fire has motivated him to
>> research SB buildings and use that information to write an article in a
>> firefighter's magazine.
>>
>> In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
>> plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
>> Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
>> between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
>> attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.
>>
>> We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
>> Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
>> dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building
>>
>> If there is enough response, I will also put together a summary to submit
>> to The Last Straw.
>>
>> Best Regards and Happy Holidays~
>>
>> bb
>>
>> Sustainable Building Systems
>>
>> San Diego CA USA
>>
>
>
> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
> multipart/alternative
>   text/plain (text body -- kept)
>   text/html
> ---
> ----
> For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN list, send
email to GSBN@...HELP in the SUBJECT line.
> ----
>
>
>
>
>
>

- --
Dr John Straube, P.Eng.
Associate Professor
Dept of Civil Engineering &amp; School of Architecture
University of Waterloo
Waterloo, ON Canada


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 16:08:45 -0500
From: Joyce Coppinger jc10508@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

The article is on p. 42 of TLS#14/Spring 1996.

Joyce

on 12.20.2007 12:32 PM, Tom Hahn at tomhahn@...:

> Bob, Bill and all - Waaaay back in the day, in probably one of the
> first couple of The Last Straws I was Editor for (maybe Issue #13,
> #14, or #15?... Joyce?), we did an article specifically on a
> straw-bale fire.  A good friend of mine, who some of you may know,
> Richard Hofmeister, and I did a little forensic investigation and
> writeup of the fire that destroyed his famous student straw-bale
> shelter at Taliesin West.  He went into a good amount of detail about
> what likely started the fire, how it burned, and what fire-fighting
> techniques were successful and not...
>
> Tom
>
>> On Dec 20, 2007 4:25 AM, Bob Bolles bobbolles01@... wrote:
>>
>>> Deputy Chief, Don Fisher, Fort Mojave Mesa Fire District (Arizona) has
>>> requested information on two aspects of Straw Bale Buildings 1) Features
of
>>> SB Construction that make our building more fire resistant 2) How to best
>>> fight a fire in a SB Structure.
>>>
>>> Having recently fought his first SB structure fire has motivated him to
>>> research SB buildings and use that information to write an article in a
>>> firefighter's magazine.
>>>
>>> In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
>>> plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
>>> Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
>>> between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
>>> attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.
>>>
>>> We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
>>> Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
>>> dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building
>>>
>>> If there is enough response, I will also put together a summary to submit
>>> to The Last Straw.
>>>
>>> Best Regards and Happy Holidays~
>>>
>>> bb
>>>
>>> Sustainable Building Systems
>>>
>>> San Diego CA USA
>>>
>>
>>
>> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
>> multipart/alternative
>> text/plain (text body -- kept)
>> text/html
>> ---
>> ----
>> For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN
>> list, send email to GSBN@...HELP in the
>> SUBJECT line.
>> ----
>
> ----
> For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN list, send
> email to GSBN@...HELP in the SUBJECT line.
> ----
>



----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 19:04:21 -0500
From: stoneandstraw@...
Subject: RE: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

Bbbobbb,

Seems to me that your fire marshall has had about the most perfect case to
write up.  They did just about everything wrong.  Using steel studs, they
placed a chimney right against the bales.  Using combustible material in a
location that should have been a fire-stop, they added fuel to an eventual
fire.  And for heaven's sake, what were they thinking of using a welding
torch on a straw bale wall.  Don't they know it is easier and safer to use
a hay saw?

I suggest that you (1) buy him a copy of Design of Straw Bale Buildings
(Bruce King, et al), and (2) go into Bill's archives and find the rash of
suggestions that came out the last two times this became a GSBM question.
There were a number of good sources listed in both places.

It seems that this comes up every couple years.  Perhaps a listing of the
best sources for addressing this question could be collected and posted on
CASBA's web site.  In fact, the best sources for addressing all the common
questions should be on virtually every web site dedicated to straw bale
construction.  The Last Straw web site has a very good set of resources
listed, but I am thinking of a list that is sorted by topic: fire, water,
strength, vermin, energy, beauty, etc.  Not being capable myself of even
creating my own simple web site, I make this suggestion in the spirit of
someone who says, "someone ought to do it."  ...then goes back to what he
was doing.

Nehemiah Stone
stoneandstraw@...



> [Original Message]
> From: Bob Bolles bobbolles01@...
> To: GSBN@...
> Date: 12/20/2007 9:55:06 AM
> Subject: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire
>
> On Dec 20, 2007 4:25 AM, Bob Bolles bobbolles01@... wrote:
>
> > Deputy Chief, Don Fisher, Fort Mojave Mesa Fire District (Arizona) has
> > requested information on two aspects of Straw Bale Buildings 1)
Features of
> > SB Construction that make our building more fire resistant 2) How to
best
> > fight a fire in a SB Structure.
> >
> > Having recently fought his first SB structure fire has motivated him to
> > research SB buildings and use that information to write an article in a
> > firefighter's magazine.
> >
> > In the case of the building fire that Chief Fisher encountered, the
> > plaster lath was attached to one side of steel studs and girts, and the
> > Bales were placed on the inside of the studs, creating an air cavity
> > between. Additionally, the barrier between the top of the Bales and the
> > attic was OSB. The fire was apparently started by a welding torch.
> >
> > We would appreciate all of your ideas about how to design and build
> > Fire-Resistant SBC and what you would like firefighters to know about
> > dealing with a fire in a Straw Bale Building
> >
> > If there is enough response, I will also put together a summary to
submit
> > to The Last Straw.
> >
> > Best Regards and Happy Holidays~
> >
> > bb
> >
> > Sustainable Building Systems
> >
> > San Diego CA USA
> >
>
>
> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
> multipart/alternative
>   text/plain (text body -- kept)
>   text/html
> ---

>




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 19:22:06 -0500
From: stoneandstraw@...
Subject: RE: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members

Bill,

I thought I remember a discussion not too long ago about adding Chris
Prelitz to the list.  Was I mistaken?  If not, what happened with that?
Did Chris decline?
If I am mistaken, then I'd like to nominate him.  He has been a bit quiet
of late regarding straw bale construction, but he was one of the most
active proponents in the early 1990s and may just have some historical
perspective to add to some questions.  Besides that, he is one of the
nicest guys you'll ever meet.

Nehemiah Stone
stoneandstraw@...



> [Original Message]
> From: billc billc_lists@...
> To: GSBN GSBN@...
> Date: 12/16/2007 3:20:08 PM
> Subject: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members
>
> Hi folks,
>
> Just to let everyone know that I've just added David Arkin, Anni
> Tilt, and Steve Goodhew to the GSBN list.
>
> Below is the list of everyone currently subscribed.  You can request
> this list by email at any time by sending an email to the list
> address GSBN@... with REVIEW in the subject line.
>
> kjdick@...	Kris Dick - University address
> shipharbour@...	Kim Thompson - Ship Harbour NS Canada
> jfstraube@...	John Straube- Canada
> andy@...	Andy Horn - South Africa
> orcaherwig@...	Herwig Van Soom - Belgium
> sh@...	Sissy Hein - Germany, FASBA
> ds@...	Dirk Scharmer - FASBA, Germany
> feb@...	Gernot Minke
> kermo123@...	Kermo Jurmann - Estonia
> paille@...	Noe Solsona, aprenticeship of Tom
> Rijven, France
> mail@...	Catherine Wanek -USA New Mexico
> tomhahn@...	Tom Hahn, Phoenix AZ USA
> thelaststraw@...	Joyce Coppinger, The Last Straw
> Journal, Lincoln
> NE USA
> atelier_schmidt@...	Werner Schmidt - Switzerland
> jim.carfrae@...	Jim Carfrae, PhD Research Student,
> University of
> Plymouth, UK
> barbara@...	Barbara Jones- England
> info@...	Barbara Jones- England
> chug@...	Chris "Chug" Tugby -
> Wales-Ireland-Scotland-England
> lotan-build@...	Alex Cicelsky, Kibbutz Lotan, Israel
> kopp@...	Sarah Kopp- Israel
> rene.dalmeijer@...	Rene Dalmeijer - Netherlands
> habibg@...	Habib John Gonzalez - British Colombia. Canada
> fiodanbuck@...	Danny Buck - Santa Fe. New Mexico USA
> design@...	Andrew Webb, QLD, Australia
> Laura@...	Laura Bartels,  Carbondale CO USA
> strawbales@...	Frank Thomas - NSW Australia
> forum@...	Andre de Bouter - France
> bob@...	Bob Bolles - San Diego California USA
> paul@...	Paul Lacinski, Ashfield, MA USA
> m.bergeron@...	Michel Bergeron - Montreal, Quebec, CA
> dan@...	Dan Smith - California
> adraprc@...	Linda Zhu - China - Adventist Development and
> Relief Agency
> (ADRA)
> Cat@...	Catherine Wanek -USA New Mexico
> zkierulfova@...	Zuzana Kierulfova - Slovakia
> jfstraube@...	John Straube - Canada (Alternate address)
> larskeller@...	Lars Keller - Denmark
> duckchow@...	Mark Piepkorn - USA nomadic
> lorobles55@...	Lorenzo Robles - France
> Zypresse1@...	Axel Linde - Deutchland
> judyknox42@...	Judy Knox - Tucson Arizona USA
> ketsie@...	Darren Port - USA
> mattsmyhrman@...	Matts Myhrman, Tucson AZ USA
> thangmaker@...	Frank Meyer - Austin.Texas USA
> strawnet@...	David Eisenberg - Tucson.Arizona USA
> markschu@...	Mark Schueneman - Colorado Straw Bale Assn (COSBA)
> kuba@...	Kuba
> mark@...	Mark Piepkorn, Vermont USA
> stafford@...	Chris Stafford - USA
> klerner@...	Kelly Lerner
> GSBN-Greenbuilder@...	GSBN archives
> mbenn1035@...	Maurice Bennett - California USA
> fredmeyer8@...	Caroline Meyer White - Pakistan and Denmark
> billc_lists@...	Bill Christensen - Austin.Texas USA
> bobregon@...	Ben Obregon, Austin TX USA
> jswearingen@...	John Swearingen, California USA
> Darrel@...	Darrel DeBoer, California USA
> jeff@...	Jeff Ruppert - Boulder. CO. USA (COSBA)
> paul.olivier@...	Paul Olivier, Washington Louisiana USA
> chris@...	Chris Newton  Brisbane Queensland AU
> rolf@...	Rolf Jacobson - Norway
> luc.floissac@...	Luc Floissac - France
> moehlmann@...	Chris Newton  Brisbane Queensland AU
> Pascal.THEPAUT@...	Pascal Thepaut - France
> autoconstruccin@...	Maren Termens, Spain
> marcus1@...	Marcus Hardwick - California, USA
> rikkinitzkin@...	Rikki Nitzkin, Spain
> janetjohnstn@...	Janet Johnston Armstrong , California USA
> stoneandstraw@...	Nehemiah Stone - Loomis California USA
> ecobruce@...	Bruce King, Sausalito California USA
> ecoengr@...	Darcey Donovan - California, Pakistan
> jc10508@...	Joyce Coppinger - USA Nebraska
> mfhammer@...	Martin Hammer, California
> absteen@...	Bill and Athena Steen - USA Arizona - Mexico
> Cd. Obregon
>
> woolley.tom@...	Tom Woolley - Belfast, Ireland
> bob@...	Bob Theis, California USA
> timok@...	Tim Owen-Kennedy  Ukiah California, USA
> cmagwood@...	Chris Magwood - Canada
> krisdick@...	Kris Dick, U of Manitoba
> john@...	John Glassford, Ganmain Australia
> brian@...	Brian Hodge, Australia
> bdco@...	Bohdan Dorniak - Australia
> bohdan@...	Bohdan Dorniak, Prospect, SA Australia
> imagine@...	Helen &amp; Per Bernard - Australia
> huffnpuff@...	John Glassford - Australia
> m.faine@...	Mike Faine - U of Western Sydney, AU
> j.zhang@...	John Zhang - U of Western Sydney, AU
> derek@...	Derek Roff - USA New Mexico
> bainbrid@...	David Bainbridge - USA California
> novag@...	Agnes Novak - Hungary
> tilla@...	Attila Meszaros - Hungary
> iaebd@...	Evgeny Shirokov - Belarus
> ecodesign@...	Graeme North - New Zealand
> sarahjohnston@...	Sarah and Sven Johnston - Geraldine, NZ
> jacksflat@...	John Glassford - alt email address
> markj@...	Mark Jensen - Redfeather Development
> ben@...	Ben Yeomans - Redfeather Development
> david@...	David Arkin - California
> anni@...	Anni Tilt - California
> sgoodhew@...	Steve Goodhew - School of Architecture, Design
and the
> Built Environment
>
>
> <<<<<< Attached TEXT file named " GSBN Digest" follows >>>>>>
> E-Mail Address	Free Form Name
> ArchiLogic@...	Rob Tom - Canada
> anovelli@...	Tony Novelli - Tucson, AZ, DCAT
> dawnaz@...
> --
> Bill Christensen
> <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sustainablesources.com/contact/";>http://sustainablesources.com/contact/</a>>
>
> Green Building Professionals Directory:
<<a  target="_blank" href="http://directory.sustainablesources.com";>http://directory.sustainablesources.com</a>>
> Sustainable Building Calendar: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/";>http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/</a>>
> Green Real Estate: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/";>http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/</a>>
> Straw Bale Registry: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/";>http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/</a>>
> Books/videos/software: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/";>http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/</a>>

>




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Dec 2007 19:27:17 -0500
From: "Bob Bolles" bobbolles01@...
Subject: Re: GSBN:Re: Fire-Resistant Straw Bale and Fighting a SB fire

Bill C, Tom, John &amp; Joyce
Thanks for the input.

Bill C
"Obviously, this is pretty far from what we consider "best practice".

Yea, that's why I highlighted those aspects.
It also makes a clear point that there are far too many examples of Straw
Bale Construction where the designer, builder and (in this case) owner,
seems to have either not bothered to consult with any of the books/articles,
or with SB building professionals - this has been one of the basic "bad
practices" that we have known for years.

"Considering the number of fires we've seen that have taken down
entire houses, I suggest that some clay fire breaks within the walls
at various locations would be wise" <snip>

One of the curious aspects of this is that clay is one of the easiest
materials to us with countless potential applications

Tom Hahn
" . . . .we did an article specifically on a straw-bale fire . . . "

John S
"Love to hear more on how the fire spread
Sounds very dangerous to provide a chimney formed by studs right next to
uncoated SB! This is a nightmare scenario to me. Maybe it was not that bad
but it violates all I thought we knew about proper SB design."

John, it is a 5,000 Sf building, with a reported loss of $750,000 - it was
that bad, and worse.
I've only see a few of the photos, but it seems pretty obvious to me that
the owner ignored about every "best practice" you could imagine, for any
type of construction.

Joyce
"The article is on p. 42 of TLS#14/Spring 1996."

 Catherine
 "(I suggest you visit the GSBN archives, or ask me off list and I will
forward all those emails to you.)"

I gratefully accept - thanks - and I will be sure that you will get a copy
of Don's article.

One theory that Don suggested was that the glue in the OSB is very volatile,
and released a highly flammable gas that additionally fueled the fire in the
cavity. Anyone have any ideas about that?

I'm wondering about the oxygen source in that cavity as well - Where did
that air come from? Would the OSB burn through before the existing oxygen in
the cavity was used up?
Los of questions.

Looks like I have a lot of research to do - I'll get back to you all shortly
Keep them comming.
Thanks so much~
bb


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Date: 20 Dec 2007 20:58:26 -0500
From: billc billc_lists@...
Subject: RE: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members

No sign of his name in a search on my GSBN mailbox (which contains
every post ever made to the list).

But I'll be happy to invite ol' BucketHead, as RT used to call him in
the very early days of the strawbale list.



At 5:05 PM -0800 12/20/07, Nehemiah Stone wrote:
>Bill,
>
>I thought I remember a discussion not too long ago about adding Chris
>Prelitz to the list.  Was I mistaken?  If not, what happened with that?
>Did Chris decline?
>If I am mistaken, then I'd like to nominate him.  He has been a bit quiet
>of late regarding straw bale construction, but he was one of the most
>active proponents in the early 1990s and may just have some historical
>perspective to add to some questions.  Besides that, he is one of the
>nicest guys you'll ever meet.
>
>Nehemiah Stone
>stoneandstraw@...
>
>
>
>>  [Original Message]
>>  From: billc billc_lists@...
>>  To: GSBN GSBN@...
>>  Date: 12/16/2007 3:20:08 PM
>>  Subject: GSBN:Welcome new GSBN members
>>
>>  Hi folks,
>>
>>  Just to let everyone know that I've just added David Arkin, Anni
>>  Tilt, and Steve Goodhew to the GSBN list.
>>
>>  Below is the list of everyone currently subscribed.  You can request
>>  this list by email at any time by sending an email to the list
>>  address GSBN@... with REVIEW in the subject line.
>>
>>  kjdick@...	Kris Dick - University address
>>  shipharbour@...	Kim Thompson - Ship Harbour NS Canada
>>  jfstraube@...	John Straube- Canada
>>  andy@...	Andy Horn - South Africa
>>  orcaherwig@...	Herwig Van Soom - Belgium
>>  sh@...	Sissy Hein - Germany, FASBA
>>  ds@...	Dirk Scharmer - FASBA, Germany
>>  feb@...	Gernot Minke
>>  kermo123@...	Kermo Jurmann - Estonia
>>  paille@...	Noe Solsona, aprenticeship of Tom
>>  Rijven, France
>>  mail@...	Catherine Wanek -USA New Mexico
>>  tomhahn@...	Tom Hahn, Phoenix AZ USA
>>  thelaststraw@...	Joyce Coppinger, The Last Straw
>>  Journal, Lincoln
>>  NE USA
>>  atelier_schmidt@...	Werner Schmidt - Switzerland
>>  jim.carfrae@...	Jim Carfrae, PhD Research Student,
>>  University of
>>  Plymouth, UK
>>  barbara@...	Barbara Jones- England
>>  info@...	Barbara Jones- England
>>  chug@...	Chris "Chug" Tugby -
>>  Wales-Ireland-Scotland-England
>>  lotan-build@...	Alex Cicelsky, Kibbutz Lotan, Israel
>>  kopp@...	Sarah Kopp- Israel
>>  rene.dalmeijer@...	Rene Dalmeijer - Netherlands
>>  habibg@...	Habib John Gonzalez - British Colombia. Canada
>>  fiodanbuck@...	Danny Buck - Santa Fe. New Mexico USA
>>  design@...	Andrew Webb, QLD, Australia
>>  Laura@...	Laura Bartels,  Carbondale CO USA
>>  strawbales@...	Frank Thomas - NSW Australia
>>  forum@...	Andre de Bouter - France
>>  bob@...	Bob Bolles - San Diego California USA
>>  paul@...	Paul Lacinski, Ashfield, MA USA
>>  m.bergeron@...	Michel Bergeron - Montreal, Quebec, CA
>>  dan@...	Dan Smith - California
>>  adraprc@...	Linda Zhu - China - Adventist Development and
>>  Relief Agency
>>  (ADRA)
>>  Cat@...	Catherine Wanek -USA New Mexico
>>  zkierulfova@...	Zuzana Kierulfova - Slovakia
>>  jfstraube@...	John Straube - Canada (Alternate address)
>>  larskeller@...	Lars Keller - Denmark
>>  duckchow@...	Mark Piepkorn - USA nomadic
>>  lorobles55@...	Lorenzo Robles - France
>>  Zypresse1@...	Axel Linde - Deutchland
>>  judyknox42@...	Judy Knox - Tucson Arizona USA
>>  ketsie@...	Darren Port - USA
>>  mattsmyhrman@...	Matts Myhrman, Tucson AZ USA
>>  thangmaker@...	Frank Meyer - Austin.Texas USA
>>  strawnet@...	David Eisenberg - Tucson.Arizona USA
>>  markschu@...	Mark Schueneman - Colorado Straw Bale
>>Assn (COSBA)
>>  kuba@...	Kuba
>  > mark@...	Mark Piepkorn, Vermont USA
>>  stafford@...	Chris Stafford - USA
>>  klerner@...	Kelly Lerner
>>  GSBN-Greenbuilder@...	GSBN archives
>>  mbenn1035@...	Maurice Bennett - California USA
>>  fredmeyer8@...	Caroline Meyer White - Pakistan and Denmark
>>  billc_lists@...	Bill Christensen - Austin.Texas USA
>>  bobregon@...	Ben Obregon, Austin TX USA
>>  jswearingen@...	John Swearingen, California USA
>>  Darrel@...	Darrel DeBoer, California USA
>>  jeff@...	Jeff Ruppert - Boulder. CO. USA (COSBA)
>>  paul.olivier@...	Paul Olivier, Washington Louisiana USA
>>  chris@...	Chris Newton  Brisbane Queensland AU
>>  rolf@...	Rolf Jacobson - Norway
>>  luc.floissac@...	Luc Floissac - France
>>  moehlmann@...	Chris Newton  Brisbane Queensland AU
>>  Pascal.THEPAUT@...	Pascal Thepaut - France
>>  autoconstruccin@...	Maren Termens, Spain
>>  marcus1@...	Marcus Hardwick - California, USA
>>  rikkinitzkin@...	Rikki Nitzkin, Spain
>>  janetjohnstn@...	Janet Johnston Armstrong , California USA
>>  stoneandstraw@...	Nehemiah Stone - Loomis California USA
>>  ecobruce@...	Bruce King, Sausalito California USA
>>  ecoengr@...	Darcey Donovan - California, Pakistan
>>  jc10508@...	Joyce Coppinger - USA Nebraska
>>  mfhammer@...	Martin Hammer, California
>>  absteen@...	Bill and Athena Steen - USA Arizona - Mexico
>>  Cd. Obregon
>>
>>  woolley.tom@...	Tom Woolley - Belfast, Ireland
>>  bob@...	Bob Theis, California USA
>>  timok@...	Tim Owen-Kennedy  Ukiah California, USA
>>  cmagwood@...	Chris Magwood - Canada
>>  krisdick@...	Kris Dick, U of Manitoba
>>  john@...	John Glassford, Ganmain Australia
>>  brian@...	Brian Hodge, Australia
>>  bdco@...	Bohdan Dorniak - Australia
>>  bohdan@...	Bohdan Dorniak, Prospect, SA Australia
>>  imagine@...	Helen &amp; Per Bernard - Australia
>>  huffnpuff@...	John Glassford - Australia
>>  m.faine@...	Mike Faine - U of Western Sydney, AU
>>  j.zhang@...	John Zhang - U of Western Sydney, AU
>>  derek@...	Derek Roff - USA New Mexico
>>  bainbrid@...	David Bainbridge - USA California
>>  novag@...	Agnes Novak - Hungary
>>  tilla@...	Attila Meszaros - Hungary
>>  iaebd@...	Evgeny Shirokov - Belarus
>>  ecodesign@...	Graeme North - New Zealand
>>  sarahjohnston@...	Sarah and Sven Johnston - Geraldine, NZ
>>  jacksflat@...	John Glassford - alt email address
>>  markj@...	Mark Jensen - Redfeather Development
>>  ben@...	Ben Yeomans - Redfeather Development
>>  david@...	David Arkin - California
>>  anni@...	Anni Tilt - California
>>  sgoodhew@...	Steve Goodhew - School of Architecture, Design
>and the
>>  Built Environment
>>
>>
>>  <<<<<< Attached TEXT file named " GSBN Digest" follows >>>>>>
>>  E-Mail Address	Free Form Name
>>  ArchiLogic@...	Rob Tom - Canada
>>  anovelli@...	Tony Novelli - Tucson, AZ, DCAT
>>  dawnaz@...
>>  --
>>  Bill Christensen
>>  <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sustainablesources.com/contact/";>http://sustainablesources.com/contact/</a>>
>>
>>  Green Building Professionals Directory:
><<a  target="_blank" href="http://directory.sustainablesources.com";>http://directory.sustainablesources.com</a>>
>>  Sustainable Building Calendar: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/";>http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/</a>>
>>  Green Real Estate: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/";>http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/</a>>
>>  Straw Bale Registry: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/";>http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/</a>>
>>  Books/videos/software: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/";>http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/</a>>
>>  ----
>>  For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN list,
>send email to GSBN@...HELP in the SUBJECT line.
>>  ----
>>
>
>
>----
>For instructions on joining, leaving, or otherwise using the GSBN
>list, send email to GSBN@...HELP in the
>SUBJECT line.
>----


- --
Bill Christensen
<<a  target="_blank" href="http://sustainablesources.com/contact/";>http://sustainablesources.com/contact/</a>>

Green Building Professionals Directory: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://directory.sustainablesources.com";>http://directory.sustainablesources.com</a>>
Sustainable Building Calendar: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/";>http://SustainableSources.com/calendar/</a>>
Green Real Estate: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/";>http://SustainableSources.com/realestate/</a>>
Straw Bale Registry: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/";>http://sbregistry.sustainablesources.com/</a>>
Books/videos/software: <<a  target="_blank" href="http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/";>http://bookstore.sustainablesources.com/</a>>


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